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Telling you carbon residue, not build up.

It's hot outside, bakes that residue on faster. As always just residue it breaks off and flies out the exhaust pretty fast. Just a start up issue, doesn't take more residue then is left after running the engine one time.

Not 100% (such a solution really doesn't exist, every issue has multiple way of happening, some leading to more severe issues others not) of Alfa's with misfire issues will be solved this way. But a certain percentage will, don't know what that percentage is.

The shut off once you can't feel the misfire and turn back on method is solid for the simple problem of only the cold start misfire.

The way you know that method is not for you is if it misfires when you start it the second time or when the engine isn't cold.

(Warm engine from running is warm enough to keep the fumes, fumes. Warm engine from being hot outside is warm enough to cool.off the residue till it solidifies..then harden the solids faster. #1 is alot warmer then #2.)
 

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Yup...... even the Harbor Freight OBDII reader works to read and clear the codes (although I'd buy one on Amazon with good reviews over the Harbor Freight one). I keep a cheap OBDII reader in the glove box of all my vehicles.

Also, as mentioned, Seafoam or similar with each fill-up and if available, keep the vehicle on a trickle charger 24/7 regardless of battery age. I also keep the key far away from the car so they don't chit-chat to each other.
Th
 

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Had to jump in on this because this was my first post here for my 2020-

I even posted my service records. It’s a big problem as all 4 injectors have been replaced (twice) new pcm, plugs, reprogramming distributor cap, (insert more) and most recently coils. Coils are the newest Alfa bulletin, FYI- Yes my vehicle is still doing it. Yes it’s back in the shop like a lab rat after making it home 1 day. The last I’ve heard they pulled the “upper portion” of the engine and were “cleaning corrosion.” Which if it’s been in the shop 14x and weeks on end and just hit 2 years old, I asked “how and why is there corrosion?”
I will say in speaking with (cough) my attorney, this seems to be a growing and common issue with Alfa and if your car is sputtering I would say be prepared to give the keys back. Sooner is better than later- check lemon laws in your state, unless you like driving in limp mode frequently.
Sorry I don’t have better news, every Alfa engineer has been through my car and it gets worse not better :(
 

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In honesty ive seen no definitive solution. Its not just carbon buildup or residue. Ive seen it on brand new engines. It may very well be multifactorial but ultimately most just get engines replaced.
 

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Yeah. One cycle dude.

Brand effing new. (Not saying that to be rude....just express frustration at the situation. It sucks) take and engine off the line start it up, let it get nice and warm, shut it off. Give it 24hrs...misfire. not always, not most, but happens.

I'm under an NDA for this, in terms of documentation, trust me. Or don't, I can only say what I'm saying, no references. Maybe Alfa is different, what I'm involved in is another brand but same symptoms (or same as some cases)

Not saying that is the only cause... It isn't by a long shot. It is a cause, or maybe more correctly a factor, there are a bunch of possibilities being researched. All we know for sure is adding port injection works and adding additional venting on the intake works..... Most of the time. Not always. It really is a conundrum.
 

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Discussion Starter · #47 ·
Had to jump in on this because this was my first post here for my 2020-

I even posted my service records. It’s a big problem as all 4 injectors have been replaced (twice) new pcm, plugs, reprogramming distributor cap, (insert more) and most recently coils. Coils are the newest Alfa bulletin, FYI- Yes my vehicle is still doing it. Yes it’s back in the shop like a lab rat after making it home 1 day. The last I’ve heard they pulled the “upper portion” of the engine and were “cleaning corrosion.” Which if it’s been in the shop 14x and weeks on end and just hit 2 years old, I asked “how and why is there corrosion?”
I will say in speaking with (cough) my attorney, this seems to be a growing and common issue with Alfa and if your car is sputtering I would say be prepared to give the keys back. Sooner is better than later- check lemon laws in your state, unless you like driving in limp mode frequently.
Sorry I don’t have better news, every Alfa engineer has been through my car and it gets worse not better :(
Lol….but yours is a 2020!!….its supposed not to do that….😲
Well I guess there are always exceptions to every rule…..does your car have the newer type of fuel injection??….
 

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I am really frustrated with this Quadrifoglio.

I bough it new in August 2018. When the car is not started everyday when I start the car again in a week usually the start is rough, the engine misfires, the CEL engine light turns on, the message "service electronic throttle" appears. and the DNA gets disconnected. Still under factory warranty.

There is nothing I can do to avoid getting that....I have tried everything.....trickle charger, push the buttom first and wait before starting, accelerating right away etc etc. The frustrating thing is that the DNA gets disconnected, and I have to go to the service department.

The only thing that would work is to start the car everyday or every couple of days. But sometimes I am not around to do that.

The car is now 33k and it has been doing that since it was 4k miles and 3 months old.

Every time the dealer had told me that these cars "like to be driven daily".!!!!...:)....that those were just some old misfires codes...that they erased the codes and that the car is now running perfectly and that they can NOT do ANYTHING. That is NOT normal.

Of course if I start the car daily that would not happen. But that is not written in the manual.

And I doubt that I would have bough the car if I would have known that.
And it seems that some other owners do not have that problem happening.

This last time I took it to the dealer and told them that I really NEED to get this problem fixed.
I even send them a couple of videos showing what happens when I start the car.

They have the SAME answer.....they can NOT do anything....everything works fine with the car....those were old misfires codes that they erased....just come and pick it up.
It is still sitting there, I really don't want to pick it up until they fix this freaking issue.

I am just fed up.

Its incredible that Alfa has not issued a recall or something like that….at least giving instructions to the service departments on how to solve the issue.???

I have read everything here, serpentine belt stretched, multiair MAF module bad, bad injectors or spark plugs, carbon build up, bad fuel pump, bad design, bad battery etc etc etc.

I HATE to admit that all the guys that told me that I was kinda crazy getting an Alfa were right.....
I took it to another dealer and they had the same explanation....these cars like to be driven daily.....

Now I don't know what to do know apart from taking it to CARMAX and getting rid of it.

I really like the car and I would like to avoid getting rid of it.
I am sure there is a fix to this issue.

Maybe I can write a letter to someone in Alfa Romeo USA?....I need to escalate this issue.

Any ideas or suggestion would be greatly appreciated.
I was having almost all those problems on cold days I had taken it to alfa and they did a carbon clean up and so far haven't had problems I have a 2018 2.0 I would try that before you make your decision
 

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Discussion Starter · #50 ·
Well I just got my “baby” back earlier today….I was missing her…..its a shame its such a pleasure to drive her….if not it would be easier for me to trade the car for another…..I can wait to try the different theories that were discussed here….I hope that one of them will work….
Just in case I bought new spark plugs…..I think it is time to change them.
So when I am not driving everyday I will try to:
1- I will try not to leave the tank empty.
2 I will add the Techron thing to the gas
3 Before starting the car I will press first the red button and I will wait for a few seconds.
4 oil change before 10 k
5 accelerating before turning it off and turning it off.(with the accelerator pressed and maybe also without)
6 more stuff that I dont remember now….lol
7 if everything fails at least I can reset the Cel by myself….(supposedly)!!!
8 if I had an engine heater I would try that too….

nothing is perfect in life!!!

keeping my fingers crossed and in the meantime enjoying it…..its a pleasure how fast it is and how smothly runs except at those cold starts.
Keeping it for the time being.

The Macan feels like a tank but also like a turtle….actually the hp number is probably the equiv to the A mode
 

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Well I just got my “baby” back earlier today….I was missing her…..its a shame its such a pleasure to drive her….if not it would be easier for me to trade the car for another…..I can wait to try the different theories that were discussed here….I hope that one of them will work….
Just in case I bought new spark plugs…..I think it is time to change them.

So when I am not driving everyday I will try to:

5 accelerating before turning it off and turning it off.(with the accelerator pressed and maybe also without)
7 if everything fails at least I can reset the Cel by myself….(supposedly)!!!
For number 5: please don't. The manual literally asks you not to do this.
For number 7: my super cheap amazon OBD reader can clear all codes Ive had so far.
 

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@Nyarmymouse42 would you mind posting the work order and /or any documentation? How many miles before you started having an issue? How many on the engine now?

Haven't heard of that being done on the 4 cylinder. Any information might be helpful for others.
I dont think I still have the receipt of the work done... but the problems started around the 47000m if I find it I will post it ... its only about $300 at the dealer for the service
 

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I’d lemon the car if possible there is no reason that a modern car should need to be started every friggen day. If it has been to the dealer many many time the carfax will be a mess. Dealing with Alfa and not the dealer. In the meantime I would take the car out and drive it hard, hard with plenty of high speed full throttle runs which tends to be harder than it would seem depending on where you live. That’s a big issue with a hyper performance car depending on where you live and how you drive, especially a daily driver. Good luck.
Agree. I did it TWICE with a 2018 and again on a 2020
 

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Same issue with my 2018 QV, fixed with a new fuel pump. 100% night and day experience. Battled for a while, sounds identical to your issue.

Had mine done at Alfa Romeo in Naperville IL. I think pump design or build in early year(s) was either faulty or something. As I understand, it was simple replacement pump with no noted difference from original - but 100% night and day driving experience.
 

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@Nyarmymouse42 would you mind posting the work order and /or any documentation? How many miles before you started having an issue? How many on the engine now?

Haven't heard of that being done on the 4 cylinder. Any information might be helpful for others.
When I was having the issue I'd just do the wheel reset after the car would hit running temp, it would clear.it sounded like a lawn mower puttering when it was happening and and the cel would go off along with service electronic throttle control
 

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Discussion Starter · #56 ·
Have you tried Seafoam in the gas tank?

If that doesn't work ..probably better to get a different vehicle. Thanks to the addition of port injection in the newer ones it doesn't seem to be an issue on anything 2020 or newer. Otherwise, lots of great cars.
I already added the Seafoam can to a full tank of gas.
By the way they also reccomend adding the Seafoam to the engine oil 100 to 300 miles before doing the oil change…..probably to clean all the thin oil passages?….but I wonder if that would be a safe thing to do……
If you can't find Seafoam, get a bottle of Chevron Techron Engine cleaner, even stronger than the basic injector cleaner. Also once cleared up, RUN IT [email protected]!!!! SOUNDS LIKE A BAD INJECTOR or>>>>>>> carbon buildup.
f that doesn't work ..probably better to get a different vehicle. Thanks to the addition of port injection in the newer ones it doesn't seem to be an issue on anything 2020 or newer. Otherwise, lots of great cars.
[/QUOTE]

I already added the Seafoam can to a full tank of gas.
By the way they also reccomend adding the Seafoam to the engine oil 100 to 300 miles before doing the oil change…..probably to clean all the thin oil passages?….but I actually wonder if that would be a safe thing to do……
 

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Hi. Just wanted to provide you with my take on it having experienced similar issues with my DFI atmospheric, low milage motor. I strongly believe you have the same kind of issues. I have linked the issues below, so you can hopefully see the full log there. As such, I will not repet the story here. But, as you have a DFI high cylinder pressure car (compression+turbo pressure) you have to anticipate cylinder rings blow-by resulting in crankcase contamination of cylinder post fire-cycle waste, which is ventilated through the crankcase ventilation line. This one usually goes back to the inlet manifold to be injected into the cylinders for a re-burn. This is a environmental requirement, and even though you will find different implementations of the solution with different vendors, it will be there! And this is where the issues start. Without port injection, the back side of the inlet valves are not sprayed with gasoline (a potent cleaner) and oil gunk will pile up. It exacerbates if the car is used in a particular way (that mostly aggregates cylinder rings blow-by), and (my hypothesis only) if the car is left idle for some time or in my case, 3-4 months a year. The reason is that the gunk left on the backside of the inlet valves are allowed to solidify. This creates turbulence in the inlet chamber, which will influence the fuel/air mix++, which will be read by the O2 sensors as an off-window tolerance and error codes could be thrown (but mine did not).
The fact that Alfa has added port injection in addition to the primary direct in cylinder one is a clear smoking gun evidence. I see that as the only reason for wanting to add complexity and weight to a motor like this - any motor in fact. Audi has already done this to many of its models. I would go as far as to say that if you are contemplating a future DFI car that do not encompass a dual FI set-up, choose another car!


My 2016 Porsche 981 Cayman GTS misfire issue and fix
 

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Discussion Starter · #58 ·
Very interesting post.

But about DFI…..my wife Macan S has 60000 miles, 7 yesrs old never had a misfire…maybe it has the other system too but I doubt it
 

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Yes, and that is of course the funny thing about the issue; you never know just how- and to what car it will manifest itself. It goes very much to driver patterns, amount of daily use, the break-in of the car as well as maintenance and probably other variables as well. But if you have looked into the inlet manifold of a DFI car suffering from the problem and just trying to scrape the gunk off the inlet valves - you will understand that this really is an engineering issue coming from chemistry (lack of cleaning solvents to oil residue accumulating onto horisontal metal plates) and physics constraints (thermo and fluid mechanics)/environmental requirements (motor spill-offs and waste residue cleansing).
I've seen many videos of Macans with this issue out there, so it is definately a problem with that car as well. Just use the car every day or as frequently as you can. That would be my advise.
 

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Discussion Starter · #60 ·
well you got a point right there, the Macan is a daily driver!!!!.....I never though of that.....the problem with the Alfa is only when I don't drive it daily
 
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