[TijoeKali]

Key words: P0440, P0455, Evaporative emissions fault leak detected, Vapor Canister, Gas Cap, vapor canister Purge valve.

I want to get a thread going regarding how to get rid of "for good" the P0440 error code caused by a problem in the Evaporative emissions system.

• Goal and criteria is that the problem and parts can be replaced by the owner rather than the dealer. (My dealer stated that swapping the parts is straight forward and easy to do.)
• My 4 hour away Alfa dealer says this is the most common problem he repairs on Stelvios. 2nd most common is the problem with the instrument cluster.
• I want to purchase a service repair CD/USB drive, and they have been out of stock for months on the Mopar online parts site. (Why can't they just burn some more CDs or copy the files to a few thumb drives.)
• To date, I have found vapor canisters for sale online, but I can't find the vapor canister purge valve in stock anywhere.
• I was told that the lines to the vapor canister has been changed in later model years to help alleviate this problem, but I can't find any detailed information on this and it appears to be only known by the dealers, and my dealer wouldn't give me specific P/Ns.

Questions for the forum:
1. Can anyone post the service details from a 2019, and 2021 service manuals of the evap. system, to confirm that there was a design change?
(Post or send me the pages on how to service the vapor canister and purge valve, and lines that connect into the gas filler tube?)
2. Can someone post the P/Ns of the parts that the dealer replaces when they do this upgrade/repair?
3. Does anyone know of any other technique that can be used to resolve this problem?

No, I don't top off the gas tank, and gas cap was tested as being good by the dealer.

Thanks.

Background for those who want more details regarding my problem:
I started having the P0440 and P0455 errors a year ago during winter. I purchased the SGM bypass harness set and bypass module last spring. I was finally able to reset the error codes and track when they came back. The error messages came back until it warmed up in the spring, then all was well until the fall of last year, when the error codes started coming back again. (During this time, car was damaged in July from a large hail storm, and we needed a new windshield. Incorrect windshield was installed, then replaced. During this process, other error codes were set that the windshield installer had to clear, so they cleared all of the codes. We set up a dealer appointment in October to fix the problem under warranty. But guess what, the code never returned after the windshield installer cleared all the codes.
Therefore dealer couldn't fix a problem that can't be documented. In the mean time, our warranty has ran out and we decided to not purchase an extended warranty.
Then the same friggen code has returned...

 

[Alfatrooper]

I recently had these error codes and had repaired under warranty.
Below, you can see what they said was done.
Has part no's for purge valve and canister.

No errors since the repair

 

[TijoeKali]

I recently had these error codes and had repaired under warranty.
Below, you can see what they said was done.
Has part no's for purge valve and canister.

View attachment 29006

View attachment 29007

No errors since the repair

Fantastic! thanks for the posting! Sure reads like what my problem is based on what my dealer told me was a very common problem on 18, 19 and 20 Stelvios.

 

[ALFAOFFROAD]

Not arguing .. obviously they aren't lying or making something like that up, why would they?

Just think it's funny such a common problem wouldn't have more threads and reported issues here....

You know, considering how often we get threads of some random one off problem where the person claim every Alfa ever made suffers from it. You'de think we would have more threads about this. There have been some but not like battery issues for instance


IMO .. goes to show even "common" problems really don't happen all that often. The current generation of Alfa's are reliable.

 

[Alfatrooper]

From jwq2 on the Giulia forum.
They are for the Giulia, but may give you enough info to get you started

 

[TijoeKali]

Not arguing .. obviously they aren't lying or making something like that up, why would they?

Just think it's funny such a common problem wouldn't have more threads and reported issues here....

You know, considering how often we get threads of some random one off problem where the person claim every Alfa ever made suffers from it. You'de think we would have more threads about this. There have been some but not like battery issues for instance


IMO .. goes to show even "common" problems really don't happen all that often. The current generation of Alfa's are reliable.

The dealer I have to work with is in Coeur D'alene ID. Service manager told me there are 9 Stelvios in our valley in Montana and he has seen 5 of these 9 Stelvios to repair this exact issue. Reading between the lines, based on what he said, perhaps due to occasional extremely cold weather (-0F temps), could be a major contributor. Our car first threw these codes in winter a year ago. He told me that only a few of the Stelvios in the Spokane valley area have had the same problem. Based on my symptoms, The car was free of these codes/problems all spring and summer, and as soon as we have a few weeks of really cold weather, the problem has come back.
(Wife hates this about the car, because the remote start stops working.)

Does the sustained cold weather cause my purge valve's plastic to shrink and leak until the car is warmed up, so the car flips the code? Or do I get a leak somewhere else in one of the lines to the vapor canister that triggers the code?

Since the purge valve is used in Jeeps, I wonder if I should call our Jeep dealer and ask how common their equivalent evaporative system problems could be in our valley.

ALFAOFFROAD: Regarding your response to my post, and reading your replies to other threads, I really am beginning to think that you are full of yourself and believe that you know it all. I ask you this. What percentage of Stelvio owners are members of this forum? As far as I can tell, I am the only one on this forum out of all the Stelvios in my valley. (I have met with and chatted with 5 of the owners in our valley, and none of them are members here. A couple of them are the ones who recommended the Coeur D'alane dealer, and told us they had the same problem in the past.)
Therefore your premise that P0440 problems are not a problem, based only on the few postings by other members is circumstantial at best.
Therefore, unless you have real data from Alfa Romeo regarding all of the problems that Stelvios have, your non constructive off-the-cuff comments are not appreciated.

Lastly, The service manager talked my wife out of an extended warranty because he believes that the Stelvios are very reliable overall, and that the emissions problem and an instrument cluster failure are the only 2 real problems he has seen on Stelvios that show up after the factory warranty ends. (Battery failure was the #1 problem but has been sorted out on almost all the Stelvios.) He said save $3K in reserve rather than get an extended warranty and it would be money in the bank.

 

[ALFAOFFROAD]

Were exactly did I say it wasn't a problem?

Obviously it's a problem. There was no sarcasm in any of my statements. If you read it that way, I do regret you are upset by my statement, genuinely. Regardless it would be good to understand the motivation isn't to upset you or insult the problem you have.


What was said is it can't be that common. My data comes from the dealer networks I work with most commonly, their warranty claims depts, management discussions, and the internal information from Stellantis they share. Alfa Romeo gets less warranty claims then most, however the ones they get tend to be more of a pain and take longer to fix..by a lot. Alfa doesn't want the dealers using consultants they want it all in-house, but they are slow and hard to communicate with. Have I seen the data on all Alfa's at every dealers broken by regions? No. A majority of those in SoCal and nationwide averages? Maybe.

Did you save the $3k?

If so, how much is this repair? If it's less the $3k, Technically he didn't lie to you or even steer you wrong. Depending on the dealer he could have lost his job for telling you an extended warranty wasn't needed, Dealers make more off those then the car sales sometimes. Doubt he was trying to be a jerk, neither am I.

Can cold weather ruin a purge valve?

Possibly, if it does it's driver error. Cold and wet make things freeze, then if a person drives the engine hard without warming it up fully that could cause metal and/or plastic parts to crack due to thermal expansion (cold canister holding hot gas/frozen valve forced to open with hot glasses running through instantly, cold hard rubber parts forced to expand as they fill with hot gases - going to be a recipe for disaster). I would not assume you or any of the people you talked to do that though, as again.... That's a known thing like the battery. No sarcasm, that is what I assume. You did not do that. Like overfilling the tank, which you did not do, but could have caused this issue. Its well known, like the battery issues, to warm up before driving hard.

Better chance as to the cause/frequency in your area?

The gas isn't great. Not an insult, can live in a good area with really nice gas stations and the tanks below ground could still be 50 years old and full of rust. In some areas of the US this is common. Especially cold areas that freeze with high humidity. Don't know if that is you, just saying.

Rust and dirt builds up in storage tanks and when the tanks get low that junk can be pumped out of their tank and into yours. Rust particles won't burn during combustion they will get sucked into the evap system, build up over time and eventually cause a failure. It can happen fast or slow... Sometimes it can even be seasonal, depending on certain variable like how often you use a station with bad tanks the issue s can even repeat itself like clockwork happening at the same time every year. Also, it isn't uncommon during the winter when less gas sells that stations don't fill thier tanks to the top to save operating expenses. Will it effect every car of every brand the same? No...but it will effect the same cars the same way. It would also effect high performance ones more as they have tighter tolerances. Not saying that is what happened .. but it's as much a possibility as anything else.

(Would a jeep with the 2.0 have the same issue? Dunno, suspect not though. They have a different valvetrain and are a lower performance engine by design not just tuning, this means it can have better tolerances for "junk". Jeeps aren't Alfa's even with the same engine and platform. Could also be it causes a different failure in a Jeep.)

Ask for you parts back... See what they are like. Maybe you'll see they have junk built up. Maybe not. If they do .. and you primarily fill up at one or two gas stations .... Use different ones. May also ask those other Stelvio. Owners where they fill up, if any of the stations are in common....again...stop using it, see if things change. However the issue can be widespread depending. In general stations in high traffic areas are better then low traffic.

Might help, might not, hope it does.

If you want to provide more info, maybe myself or one of the other, more helpful members can provide assistance.


Also... If this is because of gas or something else .... Realize that extended warranty wouldn't cover the repair. That service manager might have been more legitimate than you think. Maybe he wasn't saying there are never any problem other the those couple cluster replacment .... Maybe he was saying there haven't been Warranty problems. IE: ones the manufacturer pays for. In which case... Yeah, smarter to save the money and pay the repair then buy a warranty that won't cover it. The point of having money in the bank, is it's there when you need it... If it's more then what you need, and more then the insurance/warranty would have been.. then you are money ahead. (Unless your bank lets you put it in a giant swimming pool and you can dive in like Scrooge McDuck... Then money in the bank is it's own goal for sure)


Just guessing/playing devil's advocate.

BTW: my Forward Collision Warning and Adaptive Cruise Control are dead, warning light on dash, odometer flashing.

I am also out of warranty. Similar boat, stuff happens, it sucks sometimes. Not trying to make light of anything, just keep perspective. If there were demand for repair manuals....they would probably be avalible. Could be wrong, but...how that works normally.

Sorry if I am not helping solve this problem once and for all, hopefully the information about warming up the engine helps but again..not new info....as far as gas with rust or other stuff in it, anyone who knows how to be sure that doesn't happen please share. No sarcasm.

Or maybe share areas of the US you know have problems with rust in tanks? I know in SoCal the beach areas can be problematic. Even going inland a couple miles there seems to be less chance of issues. First thing my Dad told me learning to drive is don't fill up by the beach. Our family shop is by the beach BTW.

Notice... There is a thread on racing gas recently. In that thread it is discussed that one of the main benifits is the cleanliness of the gas itself. Part of that cleanliness is the storage of the gas, the tanks tend to be newer and cleaned regularly.